Then the question becomes, should we be training guerillas in the forst place? Abscent the threat of global thermonuclear war, is it justified in light of the side-effects?

hello, On 20040323, I re-entered the DEP as an 18x recruit. I really do not understand what your problems with this program and the current SF group are nor do I particularly care. My only question is, are any of you qualified to talk of SF, or are you guys just playing conspiracy theory on the internet? ty, CD

So "Priest" do you care or not (and why are you posting if not)? Have you read the preceeding, or do you get your exersize jumping to conclusions? Lastly, are you interested in a substansive discussion, or are you simply here to talk about your ?

My only interest to this is if any of you are in a position to talk about this, if any of you are, then I would like to talk.

Well, I would have to say that 20 years military service and a life long interest in the military, especially armor, cavalry and special forces, gives me a legitimate background to discuss Special Forces, both historically and in its current incarnation. By the way, aside from telling you about conditions in assessment, selection, training and operationally, an actual SF operator probably can't tell you anymore than I can, or any other reasonably well informed member of this board, about things like viability of the 18X recruiting program, history of SF, missions, etc. I can tell you that when I first joined the Army, there was a civilian straight to SF program. It was done away with due to quality and attrition issues. Bringing the program back is not necessarily a good thing, in light of that, for the overall quality of Special Forces. I wish you well in your training and military career.

Thank You for your info, curious, when else did they have the civilian to SF program. I'm interested in learning about how that was handled. I too have become interested in the actual "deploy-ability" status that I would have coming out of the q course with only 2 years military experience. I am interested in learning what graduates from the previous program did. TY again CD

Priest, I believe the US Army's first civilian to SF program was from shortly after the adoption of an all volunteer army until about 1985. Somewhere around 85 or 86 the Army dropped the program. During the original program there was no SF assessment and selection course. So what happened is that you went to infantry OSUT, a second combat arms OSUT, airborne school and the Q course. During Q the newbies suffered a very high attrition rate, significantly higher than candidates who had several years of service. That was, I believe, the key reason for dropping the program at the time. I'm curious, aside from ASVAB scores, language aptitude scores and being able to get a secret clearance where there any other requirements for you to enlist for 18X? What happens if you don't pass SFAS? Did your recruiter tell you what the SFAS selection rate is?

Was the old (1960s) era program of letting foreign nationals from Eastern European backgrounds go SF a direct to SF route?

Horsesoldier, AFAIK the foreign nationals that went into SF had to be in the Army already, but most of the other requirements were waivered, especially for Eastern European refugees.

No one has mentioned all the psycology testing that an 18x recruit is required to pass.